Talk:Loptr/@comment-1971498-20141231170221/@comment-1971498-20150101051244

Actually no I will have to refute that. There was no evidence to suggest that Loptr knew of Loki's true power as a "better half". In fact, he seemed to underestimate Loki's abilities thinking that he only had the power to control the eyes. It's not like Loki had any chance against Loptr either, as I doubt that Loki would have even attempted the same level ascension to godhood as Loptr did when he finally possessed the Sovereign Power.

Being a "pawn" doesn't necessarily make their efforts a conscious decision made with each other in mind. Balder was a pawn of Loptr and we all know how that turned out in the end. It simply means that Balder and the angels fell through Loptr's plans, not that they are necessarily acting out of their way to help him outright.

Loki's memories were barely even consequential for Loptr's plan because he DIDN'T KNOW about Loki's trump card (it's why it's called a trump card). There was no indication that Loki had that up his sleeve and Loptr acted on this by forecfully taking the power himself with little care about Loki's abilities to defend himself. In this regard, the memories weren't important to Loptr because he never knew of the dangers it posed to him.

There was no clear evidence that Glamor was being honest about taking Loki to Fimbulventr and operating under Loptr's orders. In fact, its confusion towards Bayonetta's involvement goes either way and makes the case more dubious. I'd argue that theres' even  more ground for the angels' puzzlement if Bayonetta was unwittingly helping Loptr much to the angels' dismay. It'd make more sense for them to push away Bayonetta since they actually DON'T want Aesir to be in a position of power, which makes Bayonetta's insistence to bring Loki up to Fimbulventr all the more confusing for them. It's especially dangerous when you consider how taking Loki in his entirety in Paradiso would mean that Loptr wouldn't be able to get a hold onto his Sovereign Power.

Among all this is Balder he IS consciously working with Loptr. He was Loptr's direct pawn in manipulating the events that would help benefit him over the other rulers of Inferno and Paradiso. It makes more sense for Loptr to be fooling Balder into killing Loki's mortal form because he's not trying to seal him in Paradiso, rather he's actually giving Loptr enough time to plan out his goals in obtaining said Sovereign power. That's the whole point of Loki being coaxed into heading up to Fimbulventr: it's all part of Loptr's deceit to get him to go where he wants him. This concept of deceit and being "led on" by the main antagonist against the child isn't enirely new as a plot device either, especially when you account for how Balder fooled Bayonetta into helping Cereza realize her true potential.

There was zero evidence to suggest that Loptr had "other means" of taking the Sovereign Power beyond coming into contact with Loki himself. If that were the case, then Loptr wouldn't have even bothered confronting Loki, as keeping his distance would have surely been a smarter plan. It's heavily implied that Loptr is self-conceited, and his mockery over Loki's designation as the "better half" isn't a factual claim but rather it was made out of spite due to Aesir favoring Loki over Loptr. For Loptr, there IS no proof that Loki is the better half, in fact that's why he thinks HE should have been treated as the "better half", for taking the initiative and outsmarting them all at once.

Again, there's no clean-cut evidence to suggest that the angels were working closely with Loptr unlike Balder's very obvious involvement. It doesn't fit with the angels goals and general endgame of keeping Paradiso in a position of power and they certainly would not benefit from Aesir's resurrection given how Loptr wishes to rule over the Trinity of Realities (something that would obviously jeopardize them if they were consciously working with Loptr).

The only plausible explanation I can see why the angels would willingly cooperate with Loptr would be: A) Loptr promised them about Jubileus' revival or B) Loptr promises to rid humanity of their power to moderate Inferno and Paradiso while unwittingly helping the revival of the God Of Chaos. If the angels were truly outright helping Loptr, then I'd like for you to please elaborate on how that would benefit their cause in light of their allegiance to Paradiso (I'm not being sarcastic, I'd actually be curious for an explanation for the angel's motives/goal if they were truly working with Loptr).